Getting MIID from Cubase Into Scaler 3

[macster]

I would like some way, any way, to get recorded midi from a track in Cubase (Pro 14) and playing, dragging, detecting, whatever) so that each chord will be the same length in Scaler 3 as it was in Cubase.
I have tried Capture MIDI Detect MIDI, Detect Audio, Dragging, Real-time recording , using scaler 3 as an insert and/or a Instrument track, etc. But no matter what the chord lengths are in Cubase, they all end up being 4 beats long once they are imported into Scaler 3. This is whether dragging or playing real-time from Cubase.

I would like to use some Scaler 3 performance features with the imported MIDI and then drag/play it back into Cubase for further editing. I don’t remember having this problem in Scaler 2.
Scaler 3 is getting level from the Cubase MIDI track and actually (only when using Detect Audio) names the chords as they come in but the all chord lengths,(except those that are 4 beats long ) are wrong. I have also have used the + Icon to drag it down do track in the “C” area.

I gotta be missing something…

Thanks for any help!
-mik

[Tristan]

Hi @macster there seems to be a bit of confusion here. You mention:

@macster

once they are imported into Scaler 3

It sounds like you are using the MIDI detection menu to import MIDI. Is that correct? Detecting MIDI in Scaler 3 does not take into account chord duration or timing. It simply presents a list of detected chords in Section A, and lists detected scales in Section B. Scaler 2 worked much the same way.

@macster

I would like to use some Scaler 3 performance features with the imported MIDI

Scaler’s motions (performances) really need to be triggered by chords, rather than responding to existing MIDI files in realtime. So a MIDI file will need to be detected by Scaler 3 first, then those detected chords need to be arranged on Scaler 3’s main track, making any necessary timing adjustments. Then you can apply a motion and it should be in sync with your existing MIDI file.

But there are alternative approaches to this, such as drawing trigger notes in Cubase to trigger detected chords, or using MIDI capture to record detected chords being triggered using bound notes with a motion active which will create a MIDI file you can drag in to Cubase. You may like to watch the recent tutorial video on MIDI capture for more on this:
https://youtu.be/9fHwoWYIxtM?si=nggGWSWMQdQ10pAR

[macster]

Hey Tristan! Thanks so much for the response!

I have watched this video previously several times and I learmned a lot from it. But it doesn’t exactly address my problem. In the video, he is starting with a chord progression already in Scaler and goes on to edit from there. I need to get an existing chord progression that is in Cubase into Scaler and keep the druiation of each chord as it was in Cubase.
Hopefully these images will help:

This is the chord progression as it is in the Cubase Key editor (100bpm):

As you can see, the chords are of different lengths, Some are a quarter note long, others an 8th note, etc.

Scaler 3 1.0.7
Simply dragging that MIDI block into straight into scaler using Detect MIDI Mode gives me this:

Notice that all chords are 4 beats long in Scaler. (BTW: Dragging this right back into Cubase showed all chords were changed to 4 beats. So that just that simple task changed the MIDI.)

Now I drag that down to the main section and get the same thing. (just covering all the bases here)

Next I tried Detect MIDI and I put the Scaler 3 Audio version into an insert on that track. Scaler was getting audio levels from the MDI Itrack perfectly. I then clicked on the blinking record button and played it back in Real-time into Scaler 3. I then dagged the result down to the main section and I got this:

Still all 4 beats beats long.

ThenI used the same method as above except using Detect Audio:

As you can see it got all the chords wrong and still all the same length.

Next I went back to using Scaler on an instrument track and used Capture MID by clicking the record button and then after playing it back in real-time, opening the folder: In this case I got nothing.

Scaler 2 - 2.9.0
Using Capture MIDI in Scaler 2 I played the same thing back from Cubase into Scaler 2, then dragging it into Cubase I get this

It’s Perfect!!!

I’m happy to try any other method that will keep me from having to do tedious editing in Scaler 3.

Again, your response is really appreciated!
-mike

[davide]

Hi @macster OK got you! I didn’t even realise that was a thing; using MIDI Capture to live capture MIDI in your DAW. I’ve always used MIDI Detect for this. Not sure why you would use MIDI Capture as you can’t use the timing in Scaler 2 but interestingly this may be a way for us to keep the timing and populate Section C with the chords and the timing. Interesting food for thought for us.

PS - Scaler 3 DOES Capture MIDI live input the same was as Scaler 2 does.

[macster]

Davide,

I know you guys must be totally busy, so know that your time is very much appreciated.

All of the proceedures below were done in MIDI Detect mode. But the manual is a bit vague on how to do this

(After selecting your preferred detection method, press Record in the popup. The button will highlight to indicate that recording is active.
After detection, Scaler 3 processes the input and presents the results in an intuitive way.)

It doesn’t say how to get midi into scaler. (Open it, drag it, real-time detection, or something else?

So I tried all 3.

First I imported MIDI by clicking the Scaler record button and then clicking on the folder icon in Scaler 3. A window opened, I selected the standard MIDI file and opened it. This is how it looked in Scaler:

I then dragged it over to the Cubase Project window to compare. The two results are from the exact same file.

Now a view in the Cubase Key Editor. (Original is in red and Scaler is in green) Sync to DAW is on.

Now for real-time input into scaler:
For this I played the Cubase midi (in pink below) into scaler from Cubase in real-time. (Original in pink, Scaler in Green)

Now the same thing in the Cubase Key Editor. (Original in orange, Scaler in Dark red)

Now just a straight dragging into scaler:
From Cubase:

Standard MIDI file from desktop:

Straight drag of Standard Midi file from desktop to scaler. (View in Cubase Project Window)

Hopefully this explains things a bit better. I tried to be as detailed as possible, but I certainly could have missed something.
If I’m indeed missing something, or doing something incorrectly let me know so I can get things going with Scaler 3!

Thanks again!
mike

[davide]

Hi Mike, just to be clear here. there is currently no way to import the rhythmic details of a chord progression. That is, you can get the chords but not the lengths of them. That’s something we can now begin to think about with Scaler 3 and chord lengths are a thing. Hope that is clear.

[vondersulzburg]

@davide

Yes if this is realized in section a or as a alternative in section c or both let us use any existing chordprogression ore a hook or a vocal from where ever and get the corespondent scaler3 chords and with the right length and from that point on we can develop further bass, melody … and so on with the so easy to use scaler3 and then bring it back to the DAW for refinement.

Hopefully soon

There are a lot of hobby/bedroom producer. I think this will help us a lot